[Supras] Want good braking?? (track use pads review)

[Walker, Brian (Rich. Dist)]

Just like you mentioned Geoff, I had hesitation (which my instructor
noted) to hit the brakes hard before a fast corner as I expected quick
lockup causing the car to get unsettled. There is a turn onto the
straight that is a big radius 90 deg. Turn connecting a shorter back
straight to the front one. It's an important turn to get right and on
street tires, you've got to drop speed quickly (was breaking from ~95
down to 65-70 pointing off track) The pads engaged smoothly and then
quickly dropped speed, never unsettling the balance. Just like my street
pads do but much quicker :)

-----Original Message-----
From: Jeff Mohler [mailto:speedtoys.racing at gmail.com] 
Sent: Monday, October 15, 2007 4:13 PM
To: Howard Hutchinson
Cc: Walker, Brian (Rich. Dist); Supras at supras.com
Subject: Re: [Supras] Want good braking?? (track use pads review)

(Same numbers, but unrelated and different manufacturers)

I set Brian up with a balanced affair..

The ST41 is a Raybestos hardcore, race _only_ pad, and the R-41 is a
Porterfield low-temp high-friction compound.

The ST41 makes pretty insane friction levels, but after properly bedded
will not eat rotors, at all.  And will last many times longer than other
race pads.  I have many race only customers lasting 14-18mo worth of
sunny California race schedules on a single set of pads _and_ rotors.
The one that that makes the Raybestos compounds differnt from other high
friction race pads as well, is that they dont come "on"
with the initial touch of the pedal really agressively.  Heavier faster
cars need a moment to let the weight settle to get peak braking, so the
application even when used quickly is very linear..little pressure =
little brake, but BIG pressure = BIG brake, and very modulation friendly
in between.  Which is also key, because you want to feel your tires as
they begin to lock and then be able to release the brakes to prevent it
without having to _disengage_ the brakes to prevent it.  The difference
there is one method is still slowing the car down, while the other
isnt......



If there is ever demand for a proper MK3 brake cooling solution, I'll
build it just like I did the bushings.

On 10/15/07, Howard Hutchinson <bighoward at sbcglobal.net> wrote:
> Great report and invaluable feedback Brian.
>
>   I'll assume that the *41 for the ST and R pads are the same
compounds, just different manufacturer?
>   How does the dusting compare to the R4S?
>
>
> "Walker, Brian (Rich. Dist)" <Brian.Walker2 at VDOT.Virginia.gov> wrote:
>   Well, I finally got to try out the new pads at Summit Point (WV) 
> this weekend. I'm using the Raybestos ST-41 in front and Porterfield 
> R-41 in rear (normally using R4S for street/auto-x). The pads did end 
> up scoring my rotors which is likely my fault from not breaking them 
> in properly. I went easy the first few laps (maybe too easy?) and then

> got a little harder on them but never really standing on the pedal. 
> The second day I was dealing with some vibration under hard braking, 
> which made me a little timid to really stand on them but when I did it

> was what I thought would require a BBK to feel. At the end of the 
> straight I was getting a little annoyed by Miatas and an MR2 for 
> braking so early. Same result through the 'chute' (fast downhill into 
> a hairpin) I was finding myself going off-line to avoid some other 
> cars. He instructor complemented my smoothness but still I'd see him 
> lunge forward at each brake application. Not one occurrence of fade 
> either (the pedal got a little soft due to the now weak link fluid) 
> but some siding due to relearning threshold braking (abs came in much 
> quicker than before so the braking pressure had to be relearned)
>
> I could not believe a 3600 lb car could stop like this! It was very 
> cool to catch lighter cars in the hairpin at the end of the straight 
> because I was able to brake so much later. The really let me be faster

> throughout the track. Got the signoff for solo (group 1) and moved to 
> the next group. The R4S stopped well last year (this is my second 
> event) but wore quickly, these stopped much quicker. I had visions of 
> coming through a downhill sweeper at 80 mph and into a hairpin and 
> sliding across the sand/grass skipping a few turns. Instead, plenty of

> stopping power even on street tires! I'll check the wear on these pads

> and report back.
>
> Brian W-88T
>
>
>
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